Last year, I was invited by Karyn Zuidinga and Rob Brodnick to talk to them on their Positive Turbulence podcast. In the episode, Karyn and Rob explain, “we delve into the intricate world of systemic design. Systemic design merges systems thinking with design theory to address complex challenges not by dissecting them into smaller parts but by enhancing their interactions. Mieke explains how this approach can transform organizational behaviors and lead to significant societal shifts. From rethinking university systems for better student well-being to using visual tools for collaborative problem-solving, we explore how systemic design fosters deeper understanding and innovation. Join us as we uncover the potential of thinking in systems, revealing how interconnected perspectives can lead to meaningful change.” Listen to the episode here: https://www.positiveturbulence.com/podcasts/interconnected-exploring-the-world-through-systemic-design/